1/11/2021 - Meeting Minutes
MEETING MINUTES
SALT LAKE CITY AND COUNTY BUILDING CONSERVANCY AND USE COMMITTEE
ELECTRONIC MEETING HELD, MONDAY JANUARY 11, 2021
COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT EX OFFICIO MEMBERS PRESENT
Barbara Murphy, Chairperson Jim Cleland, SLC Facilities
Jennifer Hale, Vice Chairperson Sean Fyfe, SLC Engineering
Mark Thimm, Committee Member Nelson Knight, SLC Planning
Rob Pett, Committee Member Jaysen Oldroyd, SLC Attorney’s Office
Anne Oliver, Committee Member Joan Swain, SLC Facilities
Steve Cornell, Committee Member 02-08-2021
COMMITTEE MEMBERS ABSENT
John Kemp, Committee Member
th
Barbara Murphy, Chairperson, welcomed everyone to the Monday January 11, 2021 meeting and Joan
Swain called Roll: Barbara Murphy, Chairperson; Jennifer Hale, Vice Chairperson; Rob Pett, Committee
Member; Mark Thimm, Committee Member; Anne Oliver, Committee Member; Steve Cornell, Committee
Member; Jim Cleland, SLC Facilities; Jaysen Oldroyd, SLC Attorney’s Office; Nelson Knight, SLC Planning;
Sean Fyfe, SLC Engineering; Joan Swain, SLC Facilities.
Agenda Item 1: Reading of the Electronic Meeting Letter – Barbara Murphy
As required by a recent amendment to the Open Public Meetings Act by the State Legislature, Barbara
Murphy read a letter written by herself as Committee Chair and addressed to the Salt Lake City and County
Conservancy and Use Committee. The letter explains that conducting a meeting at an anchor location
presents a substantial risk to the health and safety of Committee Members and others participating in a
meeting, therefore, under the current state of emergency caused by the global pandemic that exists
related to the new strain of the coronavirus, SARS-COV-2 the meeting will be held on a MS Teams video
meeting on January 11, 2021 and for future meetings notifications will be sent out as determined by the
level of risk at the time.
Agenda Item 2: Review and Approval of Meeting Minutes for December 14, 2020.
Barbara asked the Committee Members to review the minutes from the December 14th meeting and
welcomed questions, comments and/or changes to the minutes. Jenny Hale pointed out that she had
th
arrived late to the December 14 meeting but was mistakenly marked absent. Joan said she would make
the correction.
Rob Pett made a motion to approve the minutes.
Anne Oliver seconded the motion.
Barbara Murphy called for a vote and the Committee voted unanimously to approve the minutes from
the December 14th meeting with the correction as noted.
Agenda Item 3: Update on Master Plan Use and Guidelines booklet and letter to the Mayor.
Jim Cleland told the committee that he had the booklets printed but is not satisfied with the final product.
He suggested that the booklets would be useful as working copies for the Committee, but he would not
recommend sending it to the Administration and the Mayor.
1
Questions, Answers, and Comments:
Q: Who had we expected to receive this officially? (RP)
A: It was meant for use by this Committee on a more regular basis, but I think something must be done
by the Administration to accept it being the Mayor’s will. (JC)
C: I agree. Because we ask for money and receive money we should respond to that entity. (RP)
C: I drafted a cover letter to send it to the Mayor. (BM)
C: And I sent it to Lorna Vogt, the Director of Public Services, and Lisa Schafer who is the Chief Operating
Officer for Mayor Mendenhall. (JC)
Joan shared images of the printed booklet with the Committee while Jim explained his concerns about
the formatting and visual quality of the final product. Anne Oliver says they can check with Mark and Lisa
Benson who will have recommendations for a printer. Jim wanted copies at least to give to the
Administration, but all present agreed that it should be re-done, and Jim offered to pay for a new printing.
Anne suggested that Jim or Sean reach out to Mark and Lisa for advice on how to proceed, they agreed to
do so. Barbara’s letter will not be sent to the Mayor until it can accompany a satisfactory printing of the
Use and Guidelines booklet. The current printing came from the shared electronic file that all Committee
members have access to. Although the electronic file is available, it is too large to be easily usable.
Agenda Item 4: Update on Arts Council replacement for Committee Member Efren Corado
Jim updated the Committee on Efren’s departure from the Arts Council. The Arts Council will recommend
someone to replace him on the Committee, which hopefully can take place before the February meeting.
The candidate will need to apply, be interviewed, and then appointed to the Committee. Joan said that
Abby Draper of the Arts Council is working with Kathy Davis to complete an application and move forward
with the process through the Mayor’s office.
Agenda Item 5: Election of Committee Chair and Vice Chair
Barbara opened the floor to nominations for Committee Chair and Vice Chair. Mark Thimm said Barbara
had been a good Chairperson and asked if she’d like to stay on. Barbara Murphy nominated Jennifer Hale
as the new Chairperson.
Rob Pett motioned for a vote.
Mark Thimm seconded the motion.
Barbara Murphy called for a vote and the Committee voted unanimously to elect Jennifer Hale as the
new Chairperson for the Salt Lake City and County Building Conservancy and Use Committee.
Rob Pett nominated Anne Oliver to be Vice Chairperson. Anne Oliver declined because she had previously
served in this role.
Anne Oliver motioned to nominate Mark Thimm for Vice Chairperson.
Steve seconded the motion. Barbara Murphy called for a vote and the Committee voted unanimously to
elect Mark Thimm as the new Vice Chairperson for the Salt Lake City and County Building Conservancy
and Use Committee.
2
Agenda Item 6: Discussion of and creation of Sub-Committee for the earthquake damage project and
choice of 1 Committee Member to participate in the selection of a Consultant for the project
Robb Pett asked for an update on the work within the building and selective demolition project. He asked
Sean Fyfe how the work was being evaluated and by whom. Sean said that there was not a consultant on
board yet for the repairs, which is why the Sub-Committee is being created. Rob asked for clarification on
the scope of the agenda item, whether it included the interior work as well as the exterior stairs. Sean
confirmed that the consultant selected for this project would be responsible for all necessary repairs. He
explained that GSBS performed the selective demolition to assess the extent of the damage and worked
on the accelerated proposals for the exterior stair repairs based on the priorities of the Administration.
Once a design consultant is selected through a public selection process, that consultant will be responsible
for interpreting the information provided by GSBS, crafting a bid package, and prequalifying contractors
for the project. Rob asked if the interior and exterior repairs would be handled by separate contractors.
Sean said he thought it would likely be a single bid package for all the repairs.
Questions, Answers, Comments:
Q: How many people do you expect to have on the Sub-Committee, and would it include members
outside of the Committee? (BM)
A: The purpose is for the members of the Sub-Committee to have more regular communication in
preparation for Committee meetings. (SF)
C: I hope that the Sub-Committee would be doing field work and making project decisions outside of the
Conservancy and Use Meetings and bringing their decisions to the monthly Committee Meetings where
they could be discussed. (JC)
C: Yes, the Sub-Committee should meet separately on a different day and then use the Conservancy and
Use Meetings to update the Committee on their progress or address action items that need approval.
(SF)
Q: What sort of schedule do you foresee? (RP)
A: There is not a concrete schedule, but that I anticipate it being a lengthy endeavor involving consultant
selection, design efforts, construction bids, phased construction. It may take one and a half to two years.
(SF)
Q: What frequency of meetings might the Sub-Committee require? (BM)
A: It would likely vary based on the phase of the project. Early on during the design phase weekly or bi-
weekly meetings might be necessary and then later during construction it would likely be less frequent.
(SF)
Q: What are you looking for in the Sub-Committee and what size should it be? (RP)
A: I would hope for 2-3 members, experts in their fields would be appreciated, and others as well. (SF)
Q: Is the limit 5 members, because of the quorum? (SF)
A: Yes, you may not have the majority of Committee Members present because that would constitute a
quorum. (JO)
C: It really depends on what the members feel comfortable with representing the wishes of the
Committee. The smaller the number of members the easier it will be to schedule meetings and act
nimbly (SF)
Q: Which members are interested in serving on the Sub-Committee? (BM)
3
Steve Cornell, Rob Pett, Nelson Knight, Mark Thimm all offer to serve on the Sub-Committee. Although
Mark will need to recuse himself from selection process to avoid conflict of interest, his expertise will be
useful for other parts of the project. Rob asked about the schedule for the Sub-Committee and Sean said
the first step would be to share the GSBS report with the Sub-Committee and then they would schedule
a meeting for RFQ for the consultant, hopefully in the next month or so.
Barbara asked about choosing a Committee Member to help with the selection of a consultant. Sean
suggested that the person be a Sub-Committee member and explained that this person will sit on the
selection committee, which will review all the RFPs, evaluate, and rate them, and help with interviews of
consultants and contractors. Rob Pett and Steve Cornell both volunteered to assist with the selection
process. Sean, Rob, and Steve agree to discuss the schedule and then decide who can participate in the
process. Jaysen Oldroyd suggests holding a vote to formalize the formation of the Sub-Committee and the
choice of a Member to represent the Committee during the consultant selection.
Anne Oliver made a motion to form a Sub-Committee consisting of Rob Pett, Steve Cornell, Mark
Thimm, and Nelson Knight.
Jenny Hale seconded the motion.
Barbara Murphy called for a vote and the Committee voted unanimously to approve the motion.
Barbara Murphy suggests that Rob Pett assist with the consultant selection with Steve Cornell as a backup.
Sean suggested that the Committee select one person to get the advertising phase under way quickly and
that they could reconsider in the February meeting if necessary.
Barbara Murphy made a motion to make Rob Pett the Committee’s representative in the consultant
selection process.
Steve Cornell seconded the motion.
Barbara Murphy called for a vote and the Committee voted unanimously to approve the motion.
Agenda Item 7: Annual Open Public Meeting Training –Jaysen Oldroyd
Barbara introduced Jaysen Oldroyd to perform the Annual Open Public Meeting Training.
Jaysen acknowledged that some aspects of the training may be different because it pertains to remote
electronic meetings and welcomed any questions. He then began the training:
The state of Utah requires annual training and that Committee meetings be open to the public unless
there is an exception that would be available under the Act. Historically there are few circumstances in
which this Committee would not be open to the public. A meeting is a gathering of a quorum of the
Committee for the purpose of discussing or receiving comment about or acting upon something that falls
within the purview of the Committee. Chance gatherings or social gatherings are not subject to the open
meeting law, and if there is not a quorum the gathering does not rise to the level of a meeting. The
Committee must be careful that they don’t use chance gatherings to circumvent the Act.
They can hold electronic meetings because they have taken the steps necessary to create a foundation
for that. They must give notice of meetings and an understanding of what will be discussed at the meeting.
Notices must be posted at the principle office of the Committee, and on the Utah Public Notice website,
4
and be provided to a newspaper of general circulation or to a news media correspondent. If there is a
genuine emergency meeting, then the rules regarding notice do not apply. The obligation is to provide as
much notice as possible with the date and time of the meeting and the topics to be discussed. An
emergency meeting can only be held if there is an attempt to notify all Committee Members and the
majority of Members approve holding the meeting.
Meeting agendas should meet a specificity requirement that a member of the public, without having any
prior interest in the proceedings, would recognize that this is something they might want to be part of. If
something comes up in a meeting that is not on the agenda, the Committee can’t consider or discuss it
unless it is raised by the Public. In such a case, the Chair can allow for discussion, but no action can be
taken. In the past there have not been many members of the public who attend the meetings but there is
always a possibility.
Although the meetings are generally going to be public, there are certain situations where the Committee
can hold closed meetings. When discussing the character, professional competence, physical or mental
health of an individual, or if they are having strategy sessions for collective bargaining or to discuss
imminent litigation. Closed strategy sessions can also be held to discuss the purchase, exchange or lease
of real property or the sale or real property. Discussion of security devices, personnel or systems can be
done in closed meetings, as well as investigative proceedings for cases of criminal misconduct, or to
receive advice from legal counsel.
If the Committee would like to close a meeting for one of the aforementioned reasons, there is a process
they would need to follow. A closed meeting must be announced in an open meeting with a quorum
present. Two thirds of the Committee Members present would need to approve the closing of the meeting
and they must publicly announce, and the minutes must include, the reason for the meeting to be closed,
the location of the meeting, and the vote by name of each Committee Member for or against closing the
meeting. For closed meetings there should be both written minutes and a recording, and if the closed
meeting results in the Committee taking action, then both the written minutes and recording should be
saved.
When the Committee has a traveling meeting on-site, they need to keep either written minutes or a
recording, as long as no actions are taken while the Committee is at an on-site visit. If action is taken, both
the recording and written minutes must be kept. The minutes would reflect the date time and place of
the meeting, the Committee Members who are present and those who are absent, the substance of
everything that has been proposed discussed or decided by the Committee, a record of each vote taken,
the names of anyone who is not on the Committee who speaks or participates in the meeting and the
testimony of members of the public who are not members of the Committee. The recording needs to be
a complete and unedited recording of all portions of the meeting and should be labeled with the date
time and place of the meeting.
Approved minutes are the official record of the action taken at the meeting, and the retention schedule,
written minutes are kept forever and recordings need to kept for three years, unless a meeting is closed,
in which case the recording and/or minutes will be retained indefinitely. If a meeting is closed the
recording is required and written minutes are optional. There is an exception: If the subject of the meeting
is to discuss the character, professional competence, physical or mental health of an individual, or to
discuss security measures, no record must be kept. In such a case the person presiding over the meeting
5
would need to sign a sworn statement that one of those topics was the subject of the meeting and reason
for no record being taken.
To hold an electronic meeting certain steps must be taken: Establish an anchor location for the meeting,
provide notice about the meetings announcing that they will be held electronically. If comments from the
public are to be included in the meeting the Committee should provide space or services where those
comments can be held. In the current situation that space is an online space.
The Open and Public Meetings Act does not prevent Committee Members from emailing or texting other
members outside of a meeting and it does not explicitly say whether those things can happen during a
meeting, although this seems to be an accepted practice. Any messages that are sent during a meeting
that deal with Committee business would be considered records and are subject to the Government
Records Act (GRAMA). If there were a records request those messages would be subject to GRAMA and
would be disclosed unless they were deemed private or controlled messages that needed to be withheld.
There have been several cases of this recently and the courts have determined that these kinds of
messages are public records.
The Act does not prohibit someone who is disruptive to the extent that the orderly conduct of the meeting
is compromised. If the Committee takes an action that is in violation of the Open and Public Meetings Act,
that action can be voided by a court. A lawsuit to void that action would need to be commenced within
ninety days after the action was taken. If a Committee Member knowingly or intentionally violates or
advises the violation of the Closed Meeting Act provisions, that individual could be guilty of a Class B
misdemeanor.
Barbara Murphy thanked all for attending.
Mark Thimm made a motion to adjourn the meeting.
Anne Oliver seconded the motion.
Barbara Murphy called for a vote and the Committee voted unanimously to adjourn the meeting.
6