09/16/2024 - Meeting Minutes SALT LAKE CITY JOINT TRANSPORTATION ADVISORY BOARD
&BICYCLE ADVISORY COMMITTEE MEETING
Minutes of the September 16, 2024 Meeting
TAB Members present were Craig Buschmann, Greg Sanchez, Jon Larsen, Lt. Steve
Wooldridge, and Suzanne Stensaas.
TAB Members electronically present were Daniel Mendoza, Johnnae Nardone, Josh
Stewart, Julie Bjornstad, Justice Morath, Matthew Gray, and Miranda Bradshaw.
TAB Members absent were Isaac Astill and John Close.
BAC Members present were Alla Chernenko,Ashley Lodmell, Greta Sommerfeld, Martin
Cuman, and Sarah Johnson.
BAC Members electronically present were Ben Trueman and Laura Lewis.
BAC Member absent was Matthew Morriss.
Also present was Rone Tempest, Dave Iltis, Becka Roolf, Juliane Sabula, Mary Sizemore,
Jen Colby, and Gary.
Also electronically present were Amy Lyons, Heather Mclaughlin, and Geoff Dupaix.
The meeting was held electronically and was called to order at 5:03 p.m. by Sarah
Johnson.
Welcome and Member Introductions — Sarah welcomed everyone and thanked
Martin for his service as the previous BAC Chair. She and Greg will be partnering to
facilitate this meeting and to be mindful of the time, Sarah will also be serving as
timekeeper and giving time checks throughout. Members, staff, and guests introduced
themselves.
Public Comment
Rone Tempest is a 5th generation resident of the Avenues. He's here representing a
group of people who are urging UTA to put some smaller buses on the tog extension
that goes through the Avenues. On the recent 2.1-mile extension, they feel the buses are
too heavy and cause too much damage. He would like to point out that the
Transportation Division is part of the Department of Community and Neighborhoods,
and he would emphasize neighborhood because he would urge a holistic view of the city,
not just for transportation needs, but for neighborhood needs as well. Having studied
this for a couple years and having 50 years as a journalist, the Transportation Division
and the TAB by extension, has more influence over UTA than they might think. UTA
tends to view governmental entities as their constituents. So, moving to the bicycle
front, one of the great and beautiful stories of recent years has been the proliferation of
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bicyclists enabled by the e-bike phenomenon. Especially in hilly areas like the Avenues
and the Bench, and just in his neighborhood in the Avenues, including himself and
others, it's a wonderful almost European quality level of the number of bicyclists. They
say it extends bicycle riding by ten years, so it's allowed people who weren't able to do
this in hilly places like the Avenues to do it. They're still getting exercise, and he thinks
the City's initiative, the proof of interest, and the excitement over this is the instant
success of the e-bike incentive program that the City launched. It's been fabulous and
when he says that he'd like them to look at things holistically, he wants them to keep
bicyclists in mind when they start their next section which is about the fact that there
are a lot more bicycle riders in the Avenues and they are really environmental quality
because probably if they have an e-bike, they have cars or they can afford cars. So,
they're getting cars off the streets, and they have a much better environmental impact
than almost anything you can imagine. There are many more bicycle riders in the
Avenues than there are on the new 2o9 extension which averages about two riders per
bus on these 40 passenger buses. The buses are too heavy for the grades that exist in the
Avenues. The current weight of the buses they're using is 26,000 lbs. on the rear axles.
State statute sets the per weight maximum at 2o,000 a rear axle. If you go up these
grades like the 12% grade between 7th and 8th Avenue,you add 20% to the rear axle
weight. According to Pedro Ramiro, an international expert on road surfacing who is a
civil engineer at the U of U, these buses are too heavy, and the road is not appropriate
for the size of buses running there. This is why they are encouraging smaller buses, not
an elimination of public transit,just smaller buses on that section of the route. He said
this route was put in at the expense of two popular routes, Route 3 and Route 6. He said
we have a different world, we have different ways people work, the e-bike is liberated,
and he encourages all of them as advisors and administrators to put this into their
equation for what's appropriate and to serve the public and to serve the environment in
particular. He said Mr. Larson will say you need to have regional considerations
because the rest of the route does have passengers. He said the 209 is one of only two
high frequency bus routes every 15 minutes that goes through residential
neighborhoods. The other is Route 9 which is a great route and only has a small section
that's residential and is very well used.
Dave I1 is said that on the agenda tonight is more joint meetings with TAB and
BAC. He sent something to the Chairs and didn't know if it was disseminated to
everyone, so they have most of his points. He thinks the idea of having a couple of joint
meetings, maybe three per year is reasonable. Eight per year basically destroys the voice
of the BAC. Bicycling even now with a much more progressive Transportation Division
is still lost sometimes. If you look at West Temple that just got done,but no protected
bike lanes because of who knows what — no funding, no desire, or no political will. More
than three meetings per year is a huge mistake. He hopes they will vote against that. He
does think three meetings a year is pretty reasonable. He also thinks it'd be good in the
proposal that the BAC had one joint meeting here with the PNUT Board because the
BAC doesn't discuss recreational cycling on both road and dirt yet that is very much in
their purview. Recreational routes and recreational issues don't come up and the PNUT
Board deals with trails, so there's a direct overlap and he thinks it would be really good if
they had one joint meeting with them. Both TAB &BAC also have the ability as the
Board Chairs, to invite people from some of the other Divisions from within the City
such as Streets or permitting for big events. They have a lot of power to invite people so
he'd encourage them to support three meetings plus a BAC/PNUT meeting but past
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that, he thinks they would lose much of their voice, spelled out in his e-mail. He also
sees that they probably have more people from the public than he's seen in years and
that is something that would be lost by having more joint meetings, there's less
opportunity. Sarah said Dave's e-mail did get distributed amongst leadership and they
discussed it this morning and those will be key points later on in the agenda. Dave
added lastly,Virginia Street is still getting speed cushions and he's asking
Transportation to modify the cushions on the downhill sections so they're safer for bikes
and have standard speed cushions from 4th Avenue south and have a wide gap for bikes
going downhill. He said since Lt. Wooldridge is here, he wanted to mention that bike
theft is still incredibly high and there's still issues with City Creek.
Jen Colby said at the last meeting she attended, she was pretty critical about the
gap she sees between the goals and vision of the city in her 28+ years and what she
would love to see in the outcome so far. She said she's here today with a smile because
she went to the pop up for the Green Loop this past weekend. It was absolutely fabulous
and for all of the effort that's been put in, she knows it's been an enormous push and has
to say, given the opportunity, costs, and other priorities of the city, she has been a little
bit skeptical,but the information booth was terrific. The vision is beautiful, the design
is bold, and she really hopes the City can come up with funding. She knows CIP is on
the discussion today and that's why she's here. She also wanted to say that watching the
painted roundabout with the bollards was fascinating to see the drivers, it worked
beautifully. She knows paint does not offer protection,yet painted bollards can get us
really far and we could transform the city in ten years even without huge funding for the
Green Loop. She said they should do it even with paint and bollards and that NACTO's
guide,Don't Give Up At the Intersection, should be considered with that roundabout
and other infrastructure projects. She thanked the team for their efforts on Green Loop
and she's glad to see City Council kicked in funding.
Gary said he's an Avenues resident and an avid biker. When he was working, he
would ride in the city, but mostly now goes to Memory Grove, City Creek, or Jordan
River. He's concerned with safety and said concerning Virginia Street and I Street,
people go too fast, and he doesn't know if there's an option for bumps or something of
that nature. Another issue is trees blocking neighborhood signage, causing people to go
right through a yield sign and not even look towards Lindsay Garden. Fortunately,
there's only been one accident. He thanked the team for their work.
FY26 Capital Improvement Program (CIP) Funding Applications
Becka said this is the second time this has been on the agenda for TAB. It's on this joint
meeting agenda because Transportation wants to hear from both groups. TAB started
the discussion in August with Julianne who serves on their Capital Asset Planning
Group (CAP) Committee, an internal committee to the city(made up of staff). It is on
the agenda again because the decision to fund or not fund a project, and whether to put
a project forward as a funding request, or not — these are important decisions. The
boards can give staff the most valuable input on how much and where the Division
spends project money, to ensure that the projects reflect the priorities that the board
members as constituents bring to the City. In recent years, Transportation Division
projects have been focused on walking,biking, transit, and safe multimodal routes.
Internally the CAP process has refocused on capital maintenance, and she wants to see
where the priorities lie and what the balance looks like for TAB &BAC. (tangent:
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Someone asked about federal grants, and Becka indicate that national competition is
stiff for these funds, although the City has been successful in two applications recently.)
Julianne gave a summary of the of the CAP Committee process and scoring criteria.
Becka went over last year's list of CIP projects that this year's ranking process came up
with,which pretty much mirrored what the Mayor submitted to the Council. The
Transportation Division would like the Committees' input on the resulting rankings and
provide that input to the CAP Committee. Is this process is working pretty well and
you're seeing the type of projects you want prioritized, or do you think there should be a
process that puts some funds towards capital maintenance and some toward new
projects, or do you have other perspectives on funding balance? Becka explained the
difference between day-to-day maintenance funds versus capital maintenance.
Justice asked how the CAP process is looking at climate change resiliency and gave
examples. He asked if climate change is calculated into this and Julianne said it was not
a consideration, but it's good one. Julianne said she is looking for feedback from this
group on the current process and Sarah suggested they have this on their next BAC
agenda. Becka showed the format of the draft list of CIP applications and projects for
the next round so they'll understand the format when it's sent out to them for input.
Julianne noted that the constituent CIP projects don't go through this CAP process.
Due to the discussion running longer than scheduled on the agenda, the boards tabled
further discussion and asked to have it on a future agenda.
Future TAB/BAC meeting schedule —joint discussions
Sarah wanted to be clear that they were discussing the 2025 calendar. Becka said input
has ranged considerably and there have been many great thoughts. She thought she'd
bring it to TAB and BAC together so they could discuss this directly with each other.
Her original proposal was based on the percentage of meetings each group had with
topic overlap. She said Dave Iltis provided a nicely crafted and thoughtful e-mail with
his input which was discussed that morning with the Chair of each group. Sarah said a
big part of talking about this is so they aren't being duplicative in asking for City
resources. Additionally, she noted that they must meet quorum for both groups when
having these joint meetings. The group discussed the number of joint meetings, the
time those meetings would start, the length of those meetings, and communication
between these groups as far as cross attendance and reporting.
Motion: Suzanne Stensaas motioned for TAB to hold four joint TAB/BAC meetings per
year with 2 of those being at the regular TAB time of 4:00 p.m. and 2 being at the
regular BAC time of 5:00 p.m., and all being 1.5 hours. Two of those meetings will be
focused on funding and two will be focused on multi-departmental representation. Craig
Buschmann seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
Motion: Greta Sommerfeld motioned for BAC to hold four joint TAB/BAC meetings
per year with 2 of those being at the regular TAB time of 4:00 p.m. and 2 being at the
regular BAC time of 5:00 p.m., and all being 1.5 hours. Two of those meetings will be
focused on funding and two will be focused on multi-departmental representation.Alla
Chernenko seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
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Invitations to other Departments
Becka said she will need some help from TAB &BAC to invite people to come from other
City Departments and Divisions to these meetings.
Motion: Alla Chernenko motioned for TAB and BAC to write letters of invitation to
other City Departments and Divisions with copies going to the Mayor and City Council.
Craig Buschmann seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
Motion: Craig Buschmann motioned to adjourn the meeting; Greta Sommerfeld
seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously. The meeting was adjourned at
6:34 P.M.
Meeting Chat
Justice Morath 9/16/2024 5:52 PM • I'm curious about the definition of Resiliency. Is
climate resiliency incorporated? Going back to Becka's example of asphalt-with hotter
summers, more freeze/thaw in winters, dust off the lake bed... how is that built into the
calculation?
9/16/2024 5:52 PM • *climate change resiliency
Johnnae Nardone I D5 TAB 9/16/2024 6:0o PM • Really nice overview of pots of
funding (that yes, everyone is competing for). https://cityparksalliance.org/funding-
hub/transportation-funding/
Johnnae Nardone I D5 TAB 9/16/2024 6:05 PM • Bike Parking! YAY.
Ben Trueman 9/16/2024 6:21 PM • The current time (5-6:3opm) barely works for me.
4pm definitely doesn't. I could only attend in person if meetings were at 6pm
Ben Trueman 9/16/2024 6:23 PM • I could do Om on Tuesday or Thursday,but not on
a Monday
Johnnae Nardone I D5 TAB 9/16/2024 6:25 PM • Sounds good!
Ben Trueman 9/16/2024 6:25 PM • 2 joint meetings at the BAC time, 2 at the TAB time
is a reasonable compromise
Ben Trueman 9/16/2024 6:30 PM • I also like the idea of having a TAB member attend
BAC meetings
Miranda (District 3) 9/16/2024 6:30 PM • I can attend at any time, but I need to leave
for today. Thanks everyone!
Approved by the Transportation Advisory Board 10-07-24.
Approved by the Bicycle Advisory Committee 10-21-24.
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